Hello . This topic should probably have been created earlier but better late than never. As it has been the case to decide if rMT turncut and rBC1 lava cut should be considered as glitches or not, I think it would be great if EVERY decision was made by the community.

Everyone can expose the arguments on a thread made for each decision. Then, someone sums up everything and a poll is made. Everyone would have 1 vote. Votes should remain hidden until the end of the poll and some other rule should be set up so fake accounts can't be created for the votes. Those things already exist for Pokemon, for example (it's how Smogon University works when a decision has to be made, and hell there are 10 times more active players in the site). What do you think about that? You can discuss about it in that thread.

There are not a lot of decision to be made. But recently, we have that "legitimacy" question. I think it shouldn't be decided by 3 people chatting with each other in private. Everyone has the right to know why those rules are being set, and everyone should have the right to be part of this decision.

So I'll start with that. What should be the rules so a time is accepted? May it be a WR, top 10, or even any PP time. A post has been made recently by Skyfish (but he told he just translated the rules but didn't participate in the decisions). I don't know who even set those rules as there is NO public trace of it. Here is the tweet: https://twitter.com/A_alanche/status/1211529545876156417

My opinion:
- WRs and top 10 should have the same rules for EVERY time of EVERY player to be accepted. It's not because someone is very good that he shouldn't provide proof for a good PR he just set. Yacine or Diogo have been examples.

- The rules should be necessary and sufficient. As a WR holder told about that tweet, "that's causing so much unnecessary effort without fixing the existing legitimacy problems".

----> we should first discuss about all the hacks knowledges we have at the moment in order to find the best way to prove your times for now. So, I invite everyone to give an opinion about what should be made: should "original music proof" be given, or do you think it's uneccesary to check if original music or custom music was used?  If you have enough knowledges, tell for everyone what's enough to check if speedhack was used. Texture hack (for example, drawing arrows to help you with lines)? Custom textures (vehicle) hacks? Etc. Do you think players should play without SD card (you're the right to think that but I don't think it's good because unmaterialized versions + I personnaly won't like to withdraw my SD card off my new 3DS XL each time I'm tting).

It's better to create a topic so everyone can see the posts at any time whereas it's not the case on a discord channel. I invite Japanese players (who represent the majority of active players) to take part in that decision (they can at least vote and the summary post would be translated in Japanese). Moreover, there is more visibility there than on a YouTube page or things like that.

If you have any idea or reaction, please write ^^. What should be autorised only to you? I bet most of you would tell "vanilla MK7". But what about playing regular tracks on CTGP-7? What about custom music? Do you think it could give an advantage, or should we not lose time checking for it? Maybe you even want custom vehicles/wheels (same stats) to be accepted (it's not my opinion, but you can tell yours). When you know what should be accepted and what shouldn't, how to check for sure and with as less requirements as possible? If someone doesn't follow the stated rules for whatever reason (for example, 3DS dies before he could find charger,...), could there be any backup (like, many requirements that would nnot be needed otherwise, but so player with good intentions could still prove his legitimacy if he got bad luck or if he wasn't careful enough when he filmed)? What about accepting a previous WR with no proof, if the same person beats his WR? As there are more in 100 heads than in 5, I let you write there. probably the thought of some knowledgables hackers (modders, Fishguy) would be welcomed yo clarify things people wonder.
EDIT: Don't forget, rules will be followed better if people know why they are set (and maybe even better if they took part in the decision). People have to know the rules, but they also have the right to know why they have to follow these rules (and no, the community isn't too dumb to understand or try understanding that). The community should also have more powers in the decision making as it's the community who feeds the top 10/WR rankings.

In my opinion it is completely ridiculous to remove PAST WRs based on FUTURE decisions
So if new rules go into play they should not be retrograde
Let me also be hypocritical for a second
At the same time, I still think that WRs with no videos at all shouldnt be put on the WR site, that extending to only these pending WRs and not WRs with no video from a year ago or whatever
The discussion has been too vocal for too long for a non video WR to be accepted at this point
As for very recent pending times, I think the rule change wasnt vocalized enough, I barely knew it even happened and I think expecting players to follow them immediately isnt fair, there should be a grace period
We need to spread the word more before we crack down on times with "insufficient" proof

Here are my opinions on this entire topic

Original game audio needed
Custom music allowed
No custom textures of any kind (track, kart, character, etc)
Speedometer allowed, in my opinion this is actually helpful for proof
Original game replay needed (this means picture proof alone isnt sufficient)
Top and bottom screen
Protocol only needed if you submit a suspicious time (what counts as suspicious?)

Should my opinion be on this thread or a separate one

BMence wrote on 12/30/19 at 02:26:09:


Hey Mence  


A poll: I’m not a big fan of deciding rules with a poll. You always have voters who don’t read all the arguments, or players who want to troll. A topic like this is better. Where the best arguments will win the discussion.

Custom music: You can benefit from custom music, just use your imagination. I don’t think anyone used custom music to gain an advantage already. But I can assure you that from the moment you say out loud custom music is allowed, players will find a way to exploit this rule. And the use of original sound is not hard to prove. Just turn on the volume from your 3DS for recording. Do you want to edit some music in your WR video? Fine, but link the video with original sound in your description. Coin sounds are also a reason why you need original audio in your video. To verify if you did not start with more than 0 coins.

Game replay is necessary: The game replay (or recording the run live) is the only way to prove no custom modifications were used. So record it! If anyone knows how you still can prove this afterwards, I would be happy to hear about it. Because it is really unfortunate if you weren’t able to record for whatever reason. Everyone who has just set a new PR should take a picture first (top and bottom screen). And then prepare to record the game replay.

A WR with insufficient proof can still be added when the player beats it: I can agree with that.

Time trial on ctgp7: I was divided if we should allow this. But all players who know much more about ctgp-7 than me, tell me it should be allowed.

Playing without SD card: I don’t like to enforce this, seems annoying and unnecessary, and my MK7 is preinstalled.

Emulators: I understand why we should adapt the rules to exclude the use of emulators.

Allowing speedometer: I don’t really have an opinion.

Protocol: We have changes planned for the protocol. The part where you start up your 3DS. I believe there were still things that had to be tested before making these changes. Providing a protocol video should be required in case of suspicions. Silver asks what is suspicious. Suspicious, to me, is when there are players who have doubts.

Strict rules: Would be best. For all players, trusted or not. And definitely for world records. I agree with the rules that Paradox stated.

Twi_LiteMK wrote on 12/30/19 at 20:17:58:


???????

Frederiek wrote on 01/01/20 at 12:29:15:


I don't like that idea. Look at Yacine, he only faked WW top 10's and this is probably because he knew he would be subject to less investigation from us.