Jazzy wrote on 09/05/19 at 13:35:32:



I have already asked Alex to update the joining page to not allow it on Super Mario Kart due to the same save states / rewind feature it apparantly has as per the Wii U etc. The same situation would apply with the other systems regarding live streaming. As far as I know also on the Mario Kart 64 site everyone pretty much only streams via the original console or the original Wii. I am out of the country for a while but if anyone can confirm the interface exactly in case there is anything additional we need to know about? Mainly everyone is testing out the online multiplayer feature as that has been of main interest.

hahaae wrote on 09/05/19 at 20:34:35:


Hi man, I have tweeted back already. Please read what I wrote.

I think everyone is a little overexcited at the moment mainly with the addition for online playing, I think that is what is most of the focus as it was something the public generally wanted to do. Which is good. I have had a read on various sites this morning and general feedback hasn't really been a demand for SMK, but more for all of the games (and a lot questioning the missing Donkey Kong Country games - which willl hopefully be released later) however yes we will have people approaching us. Before anything else I would recommend everyone who can do to test this system thoroughly. Then we can see about any side projects. I had concerns about how consistent the online was, people have had mixed results so far and it may be just down to connection. Some of the guys have been using net play. There was SNESOT prior to this. So this could lead to a new online multiplayer site of some kind being created in future. Perhaps a spiritual successor to SNESOT? If anyone has any ideas please do share.

Just a thought, if players truly want to take part, I'm sure they would be keen and very many have done so, in getting an original SNES. When there is a will, there is a way.

The specific timing on the original SNES is always better than any other system and it is the best one to train on for those that want to enter the Championships SMKC and ASMKC. A few players have noted it would be a bit useless for Championship training but let's see first when they do comparisons. Let's park that thought aside for the moment and look at the fun aspect too. We have played on emulators for SNESOT and I'm sure those who used netplay will agree on the timing and lag differences. If they just wanted to play Time Trial only and online for fun that is a separate matter. But then in that case if they were allowed to use the new system they would have absolute zero reason to get an original SNES. Same situation. Unless they are gearing towards the Championships.

So like SNESOT if there are any other projects, they could be built externally in future and linked up. Please let us know any feedback on your experiences playing this weekend.

Please note that I am out of the country for some time for important reasons. I have hardly slept last night so sorry if I have missed anything. I will try to check here when I can. Looking forward to hear anymore feedback from you guys.

Harvey Kartel wrote on 09/05/19 at 22:43:23:


+1,000,000

But still... let's let everyone use it first for a while and let us know their thoughts on the online multiplayer system. I am keen to hear a list of Pros and Cons.

Having them allowed on the yearly sites (if they would ever make an appearance) would be a very sensical thing to do. Sort of like a gateway to the real thing for spin-off version users. If they get hooked enough, they'll invest in a SNES down the line to join the eternal rankings.  

Of course yearly sites would be a completely separate entity from the Players' Site database. So any fallout from saved state abuse or whatever won't hit the Players' Sites' shores. Or am I being too naive?

KVD wrote on 09/06/19 at 04:12:18:


Jazzy, what do you think of this as a solution? This would have to be a separate entity though. Like the Non-NBT or GP 150cc sites. If someone wants to do it. On a separate note I read that the Non-NBT site will no longer be updated by Alicia, so that needs someone to take over too.

Then as Ethan said earlier if players want to get into it more seriously then they can invest in an original SNES (with a view to attend a championship for example as well which in that case they will need moreso). David said it doesnt feel that great to play on. But there are mixed views. How many of you have tried it?

This way there would be a solution for those who want to take part in some form with the Switch and stream only.

What do you all think?

Silly question but might not be. Does anyone from MK64 site stream from a virtual console because that might be ok to, or is that also not allowed? They dont have N64 Switch Online yet as far as I know but that may happen next? Would that be the same question there too? Maybe Moll cananswer that one as he plays MK64 more and is involved with the community there at their championships. Just wondered.

mk64 main site only allows wii vc not wii u vc (same as here, basically no savestates). The yearly site lets anyone join (from pc emulator users to n64 users).

I really do think the site is severly limiting itself by not allowing switch/wii u/snes classic users join out of a fear that they will use some barely functional savestate functionality to cheat. Its actually easier to cheat in a useful manner on a 'real' snes than it is on those systems.

Honestly I think players should be allowed to use Switches for rankings. People who are going to cheat are going to try to find a way to do it anyway. The whole site practically runs off a trust system to begin with, and as a result those who are caught are rightfully going to be banned forever.

I understand you could make the argument that players can "prove" savestated times with pictures, but in reality, even for people who play on an original SNES, we know that picture proof is no longer valid to begin with due to the Switch existing like this (it never really was either).

I really see absolutely no reason why streamed attempts could not be accepted on the Players Page, unless i'm missing something like the game being slightly different, which I don't think I am. I know the console is cheap now, but I personally think it's a really old fashioned mindset to just expect new players to buy an original SNES just to TT. New players absolutely won't do it (the incentive to get a SNES goes down considering most of the best games will be on the Switch in the future as well). There's almost no reason to do it outside of appeasing older community veterans, which new players will not do. I own SMK on the SNES too, but my SNES loses save data frequently if I accidentally move a cable too harshly from what I've noticed when a cartridge is in it. I decided to use the Wii instead for my past records. To someone who is just alright at the game, it's a way better way to play the game than the original SNES (which is my first console that I'm super nostalgic for).

I feel like if anything, it would be a missed opportunity to not take full advantage of the Switch offering SMK to begin with. This really is huge and I feel like there's not actually an urgency to capitalize on it here. This is probably the most unique opportunity for the game since making the TT site to begin with over 15 years ago. Online play is now super easy, even if it still is just for 1v1s. Playing actual people on SMK has never been an easy thing before. The Switch is a popular console, and a whole new generation of Nintendo fans that want to be able to play, MK8, Ultimate, Splatoon, etc. online have this game on the table for free now. If anything the Switch version should be embraced and maybe have some tournaments offered for it, just my opinion.

I may be wrong, but I don't think we'll see the creation of a yearly site very soon. It's quite a big undertaking and requires someone with sufficient knowledge and motivation to pull it off. The problem is that it basically needs to be created from scratch, as the MK64 one uses a different database system.

Goomba brought up an interesting point in one of the underground WhatsApp groups ( ). We could profit from this wave of resparked interest in SMK by allowing Switch users to join the rankings, but limit it to top-100 or top-50 (for example). As soon as they start getting times below this threshold, real SNESes would be the requirement (community pressure for players committed enough to get times of this level would probably win out; like SM64 allows VC and stuff but all of the real top players are competing on N64).

Obviously, if such a rule could be implemented, this would put the effort back in Sami's court right now. Outside of the question whether he (and we) feel(s) it's the right thing to do or not, I don't know if he even has the time or knowledge at this point to make the rankings ready to include Switch users...would it require Penev? To create like an extra filter or whatever (ala speedrun.com rankings).

Thoughts?

Talking about SMK for Nintendo Switch here is my Friend Code: SW-0474-3384-3616

Please add me if you want to play SMK against me, I'll be ready playing against anybody starting from Friday the 13th this week, I'll play non-NBT* (only) and in GP and MR (only).

*I could play in NBT because I have a SF30 Pro gamepad by 8Bitdo, this one, but I'm not going to open this kind of gamepad just to make the D-pad pro-NBT (in case of failure), and the SF30 Pro is one of the best controllers for Nintendo Switch and I don't want to mess that up, but instead of that I'll buy the official SNES controller for Nintendo Switch soon and then I'll transform it as a pro-NBT controller and so I'll play in NBT mode (you'll be notified or you'll notice it).




                    Cheers!

wxyz wrote on 09/10/19 at 07:23:34:


Thanks for the details David. So basically extremely awkward NBTs will.pretty much not happen but then general ones which have wider or easier preparation are possible but maybe not so sharply done. DP1 etc.

wxyz wrote on 09/10/19 at 07:23:34:


So, I'm so glad I haven't tried this before, my SF30 remains safe

Sami de la SMK wrote on 09/10/19 at 07:32:51:


Yes thank you mate! And for a definite answer Sami, we just have to wait for the release of the official SNES controller for Nintendo Switch from Nintendo, this one, maybe making pro-NBT this controller will be perfect for wild NBTs

I don't think perfect nbt will be possible on switch with any controller (similar to with snes classic) as the way dpads are interpreted is different. I believe they are seen as 8way hat switch style inputs now rather than as 4 buttons so no longer possible to have simultaneous opposing directions pressed (hebce can't just mush the whole dpad down when generating boosts, have to be much more left-right movement precisie otherwise you will get locked into a single direction and get wildly thrown off course).

But this only really affects those nbts where you mush the dpad on a straight, for multiplayer play it is fine and for decent time trials it is also fine, just certain boosts become more difficult to control the build up of.