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Mafia: Town of Memes - Mafia Victory (Read 18291 times)
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #700 - 08/13/16 at 09:55:25  
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:28:45:
TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:12:21:
Racer727 wrote on 08/12/16 at 06:46:46:
Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 01:19:36:
Actually scratch that, everyone, answer #318 pls thxz

I might as well. Although SG is super scummy, lynching him isn't our best bet because either Dan or Leone would give is much more info.

I feel like Dan is a better lynch because if Leone keeps posting like he did after his research paper, he's a valuable asset and I feel like it's the type of play only town can come up with. Dan has been arguing with ALAK all day And while Leone has made a good effort at scum hunting. Nevertheless, I still want to , keep my vote on SG, because even if he's town, he should play much better regardless.


I actually totally disagree with you there. Look at Leone's research. TYG is neutral, Sportsguy is unreadable, TvK is neutral. You don't have o do a lot of research to come to that conclusion. Where do you see Leone scumhunting? Don't you think he at least should put his vote down on anyone? Could you tell me right now where Leone is trying to convince us to vote or at least pressure someone? Or do we have a different definition of scumhunting?

This is where I defend Leone pretty much calling him town, and you say that it is stupid, because Leone wasn't doing good hunting. It turns out Leone did vote John, his scum lean, and John is now being acknowledged by the stronger players that it is possible that John is Maf. Leone did do a good job here and yu totally shot him down without a chance for him to prove himself.


Please, highlight, bold, underline any part of my post where I call your theory stupid. I said I disagreed with it and I asked you a bunch of questions, which, if answered correctly, could have me maybe pointed me in the right direction of where I could find any evidence of Leone scumhunting. Also note that Leone had not voted John at this point, so nice try using that against me. Leone even withheld his vote until I specifically told him to put it down. Added to that, nowhere in my post am I gunning down Leone. This post is entirely aimed at you. And maybe your memory is failing on you, but do you remember what your next post was? Well, I do:

Racer727 wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:33:32:
TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:12:21:
I actually totally disagree with you there. Look at Leone's research. TYG is neutral, Sportsguy is unreadable, TvK is neutral. You don't have o do a lot of research to come to that conclusion. Where do you see Leone scumhunting? Don't you think he at least should put his vote down on anyone? Could you tell me right now where Leone is trying to convince us to vote or at least pressure someone? Or do we have a different definition of scumhunting?

Mine is digging up posts and commenting on it. But even rhen, I do agree he should come up with a conclusion and vote someone. I only say Dan is the better lynch because I feel we can get more info out of it.


Is it just me, or are you agreeing with me on the points that you are now using to attack me with? If you had a problem with my way of trying to get Leone lynched, then you should have spoken up yesterday, when you still had a chance to save him. Your next post is about Kyle by the way, so your lack of another answer made me believe that you kept on agreeing with me. Don't throw this bullshit into my face.


TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 15:29:17:
Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 15:15:01:
He's my scummiest read because I'm 90% sure maf are on my wagon (see me as an easy mislynch), and because he seems reluctant to focus additionally on other people, as if he's trying to avoid retaliatory heat. That being said, TYG is looking worse with each post. If John is scum he'll do plenty more weird things before the game is up, and I think eliminating TYG may tell us some things about YS (re: "TYG is doing fine") and maybe some others.

[vote]theyounggun[/vote]


As much as I thought TYG was scum, I'm not liking where this wagon is going so fast. A couple of posts ago Leone was adamant about keeping his vote on John, even asking people why he should move his vote because he couldn't see a better option. Now the opportunity to save himself has come: TYG's wagon is taking off.

It seems like I'm going against my general read of TYG, but this feels like a standard counterwagon to steer away from the pressure on a member of the mafia, or a wagon started by a own member used by the mafia to achieve the same purpose. Is there anyone else who happens to feel the same about this?

Here you shoot down a good counterwagon on someone more scummy. It's really bad play to go against your feelings of someone scummy. If two of your strongest town reads goes to someone you think is scummy, shouldn't you join the wagon? Wouldn't it be better than the other wagon if your towniest reads are leaving?

Those are the worst posts that struck out at me, and since you want me to scum hunt, here it is. [/quote]

Well here you are straight up misrepping me. At that point, Dan was a slight town read, Zoran was neutral, and you fail to mention it, but the next person to jump on TYG was Leone, my #1 scumread. Look up my readslist, you'll see that I'm right. I can't allow my #1 scumread to jump on a counterwagon lead by others because it might have PULLED PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE WAGON I BUILT ON MY #1 SCUMREAD. I don't know how you're trying to attack me here Racer, but I still can't see any substantial evidence against me. It just seems like you're set on getting me lynched no matter what.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #701 - 08/13/16 at 09:56:45  
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:25:28:
I suppose Dan and Zoran look better in my eyes after this analysis. I think the SG kill is something Dan would do though, didn’t he go for Lafungo in Shock’s first game? But Kyle was also part of that Mafia team.


One thing I will agree with, I don't think the SG kill happens in a team where all the mafia players are inexperienced.  I think there is at least 1 "experienced" player on the team making that kill.  Weird to me then that Kyle brought up the possibility of the mafia team being PAF, Racer, and TYG.  Also weird that TvK's four strongest town leans were 4 of the most experienced players.  If he was town he would be adding himself as a 5th very experienced player.  Does TvK town really come up with those reads and not bring up the SG kill?

I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?

He's playing different from other games. I really feel like this time around TvK is Maf trying to play the same to confuse others, but I'm getting the vibes of Maf.
Did that make any sense?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #702 - 08/13/16 at 09:58:18  
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:25:28:
I suppose Dan and Zoran look better in my eyes after this analysis. I think the SG kill is something Dan would do though, didn’t he go for Lafungo in Shock’s first game? But Kyle was also part of that Mafia team.


One thing I will agree with, I don't think the SG kill happens in a team where all the mafia players are inexperienced.  I think there is at least 1 "experienced" player on the team making that kill.  Weird to me then that Kyle brought up the possibility of the mafia team being PAF, Racer, and TYG.  Also weird that TvK's four strongest town leans were 4 of the most experienced players.  If he was town he would be adding himself as a 5th very experienced player.  Does TvK town really come up with those reads and not bring up the SG kill?

I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?

It is kinda weird he did those things, somethings off about him.....
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #703 - 08/13/16 at 09:59:26  
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?

I didn’t think he was Mafia before Yoshistar exposed him. I suppose the rest of your post makes sense. You and Zoran’s bad D1 posts are still on the back of my mind, though.

Yoshistar™ wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:53:26:
I did not disappeared, I read the new posts and after your post ALAKTORN, I feel like you're trying to save TYG from getting lynched and want to lynch me instead. Why are you suddenly confident that I'm maf? What happened to your "YS is townie" lean?

Lynching TYG won’t change my theory, if people want to lynch him then that’s their decision, but if he flips Town they can go back and read my theory. I don’t think I’ve ever read you all game, because you’ve barely posted. All I’ve been saying was that I Town read you in previous games where you were, and that it was easy to read you.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #704 - 08/13/16 at 10:02:22  
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:56:45:
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:25:28:
I suppose Dan and Zoran look better in my eyes after this analysis. I think the SG kill is something Dan would do though, didn’t he go for Lafungo in Shock’s first game? But Kyle was also part of that Mafia team.


One thing I will agree with, I don't think the SG kill happens in a team where all the mafia players are inexperienced.  I think there is at least 1 "experienced" player on the team making that kill.  Weird to me then that Kyle brought up the possibility of the mafia team being PAF, Racer, and TYG.  Also weird that TvK's four strongest town leans were 4 of the most experienced players.  If he was town he would be adding himself as a 5th very experienced player.  Does TvK town really come up with those reads and not bring up the SG kill?

I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?

He's playing different from other games. I really feel like this time around TvK is Maf trying to play the same to confuse others, but I'm getting the vibes of Maf.
Did that make any sense?


I was trying to hunt scum, but instead I've had to spend all this time defending myself, just as Dan has had to do all D1 long. Yes, I've lead the wagon on a now confirmed townsperson, but if you remember correctly, I did the same thing in Shock's first game. I'm trying hard to put some focus on people who have been outside of the picture in D1, namely John, who was a scumread of a CONFIRMED TOWN member:

Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 16:15:43:
Since ima likely die soon, I'll post my leans (see reasoning in my previous posts) :

Possible maf:
John
TYG
YS
SG (weird interaction above)

Probable Town:
TvK
ALAK
Dan

Neutral:
everyone else

Hopefully I'll have enough time to make a few more investigations before EOD, dinner rn.


The fact that nobody is picking up on my big posts about wagonomics and why I thnk John deserves more attention is a big red flag in my eyes.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #705 - 08/13/16 at 10:05:58  
TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:55:25:
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:28:45:
TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:12:21:
Racer727 wrote on 08/12/16 at 06:46:46:
Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 01:19:36:
Actually scratch that, everyone, answer #318 pls thxz

I might as well. Although SG is super scummy, lynching him isn't our best bet because either Dan or Leone would give is much more info.

I feel like Dan is a better lynch because if Leone keeps posting like he did after his research paper, he's a valuable asset and I feel like it's the type of play only town can come up with. Dan has been arguing with ALAK all day And while Leone has made a good effort at scum hunting. Nevertheless, I still want to , keep my vote on SG, because even if he's town, he should play much better regardless.


I actually totally disagree with you there. Look at Leone's research. TYG is neutral, Sportsguy is unreadable, TvK is neutral. You don't have o do a lot of research to come to that conclusion. Where do you see Leone scumhunting? Don't you think he at least should put his vote down on anyone? Could you tell me right now where Leone is trying to convince us to vote or at least pressure someone? Or do we have a different definition of scumhunting?

This is where I defend Leone pretty much calling him town, and you say that it is stupid, because Leone wasn't doing good hunting. It turns out Leone did vote John, his scum lean, and John is now being acknowledged by the stronger players that it is possible that John is Maf. Leone did do a good job here and yu totally shot him down without a chance for him to prove himself.


Please, highlight, bold, underline any part of my post where I call your theory stupid. I said I disagreed with it and I asked you a bunch of questions, which, if answered correctly, could have me maybe pointed me in the right direction of where I could find any evidence of Leone scumhunting. Also note that Leone had not voted John at this point, so nice try using that against me. Leone even withheld his vote until I specifically told him to put it down. Added to that, nowhere in my post am I gunning down Leone. This post is entirely aimed at you. And maybe your memory is failing on you, but do you remember what your next post was? Well, I do:

Racer727 wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:33:32:
TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 07:12:21:
I actually totally disagree with you there. Look at Leone's research. TYG is neutral, Sportsguy is unreadable, TvK is neutral. You don't have o do a lot of research to come to that conclusion. Where do you see Leone scumhunting? Don't you think he at least should put his vote down on anyone? Could you tell me right now where Leone is trying to convince us to vote or at least pressure someone? Or do we have a different definition of scumhunting?

Mine is digging up posts and commenting on it. But even rhen, I do agree he should come up with a conclusion and vote someone. I only say Dan is the better lynch because I feel we can get more info out of it.


Is it just me, or are you agreeing with me on the points that you are now using to attack me with? If you had a problem with my way of trying to get Leone lynched, then you should have spoken up yesterday, when you still had a chance to save him. Your next post is about Kyle by the way, so your lack of another answer made me believe that you kept on agreeing with me. Don't throw this bullshit into my face.


TvK wrote on 08/12/16 at 15:29:17:
Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 15:15:01:
He's my scummiest read because I'm 90% sure maf are on my wagon (see me as an easy mislynch), and because he seems reluctant to focus additionally on other people, as if he's trying to avoid retaliatory heat. That being said, TYG is looking worse with each post. If John is scum he'll do plenty more weird things before the game is up, and I think eliminating TYG may tell us some things about YS (re: "TYG is doing fine") and maybe some others.

[vote]theyounggun[/vote]


As much as I thought TYG was scum, I'm not liking where this wagon is going so fast. A couple of posts ago Leone was adamant about keeping his vote on John, even asking people why he should move his vote because he couldn't see a better option. Now the opportunity to save himself has come: TYG's wagon is taking off.

It seems like I'm going against my general read of TYG, but this feels like a standard counterwagon to steer away from the pressure on a member of the mafia, or a wagon started by a own member used by the mafia to achieve the same purpose. Is there anyone else who happens to feel the same about this?

Here you shoot down a good counterwagon on someone more scummy. It's really bad play to go against your feelings of someone scummy. If two of your strongest town reads goes to someone you think is scummy, shouldn't you join the wagon? Wouldn't it be better than the other wagon if your towniest reads are leaving?

Those are the worst posts that struck out at me, and since you want me to scum hunt, here it is.


Well here you are straight up misrepping me. At that point, Dan was a slight town read, Zoran was neutral, and you fail to mention it, but the next person to jump on TYG was Leone, my #1 scumread. Look up my readslist, you'll see that I'm right. I can't allow my #1 scumread to jump on a counterwagon lead by others because it might have PULLED PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE WAGON I BUILT ON MY #1 SCUMREAD. I don't know how you're trying to attack me here Racer, but I still can't see any substantial evidence against me. It just seems like you're set on getting me lynched no matter what. [/quote]
My apologies here. I guess I still have much to learn here in scum hunting. It is less the posts and more the vibes that get me to vote people or not. That is how come I don't pull up posts to often. However, I still feel you are playing differently form the last games, and I want to get to the bottom of it, so I'm not going to completely stop the pressure.


Tere is the matter of you not posting but being on. That is very suspicious, don't you agree.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #706 - 08/13/16 at 10:07:33  
Goddamnit I somehow deleted one part in my theory post before posting.

kyleb30 wrote on 08/13/16 at 08:44:57:
PAF I'd like you to address your EoD actions. As TvK said, your actions were without a doubt scummy. The way I'm seeing your EoD is that you unvoted because you knew there was no point in staying on Dan since his wagon wouldn't take off. However, when ALAK said he'd take the hit for you if you voted Leone, and you felt that was your out and decided to keep your vote on Leone in order to assure a townie dies D1.

If this is indeed the case, I would say it's fair to asssume he (and his other scumbuddy) were trying to protect a scumbuddy that had significant heat on them, which would be TYG. This works as well because I would expect these 2 players to panic. The question is, at this point, who's the mastermind behind it all...

Anyways, PAF, I'd like you to let us know if you actually thought Leone was scum, and if so what tipped you off on it. Also, I want to hear others thoughts on PAF, because I don't think these actions should go without a serious discussion.

I commented how this was a really late D2 first post and how it made no sense because from Town perspective D1 lynch and N1 went absolutely like shit, and he doesn’t even aknowledge that. Fuck, I must’ve lost that part while trying to stitch the theory together.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #707 - 08/13/16 at 10:07:41  
Yoshistar™ wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:58:18:
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:25:28:
I suppose Dan and Zoran look better in my eyes after this analysis. I think the SG kill is something Dan would do though, didn’t he go for Lafungo in Shock’s first game? But Kyle was also part of that Mafia team.


One thing I will agree with, I don't think the SG kill happens in a team where all the mafia players are inexperienced.  I think there is at least 1 "experienced" player on the team making that kill.  Weird to me then that Kyle brought up the possibility of the mafia team being PAF, Racer, and TYG.  Also weird that TvK's four strongest town leans were 4 of the most experienced players.  If he was town he would be adding himself as a 5th very experienced player.  Does TvK town really come up with those reads and not bring up the SG kill?

I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?

It is kinda weird he did those things, somethings off about him.....

I think this is the first time I have agreed with YS all day.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #708 - 08/13/16 at 10:08:16  
I'll go through d2 stuff later, not sure when i'll be back (today for sure). Being awake until 4 in the morning messed me up  Tongue.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #709 - 08/13/16 at 10:08:32  
TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:02:22:
The fact that nobody is picking up on my big posts about wagonomics and why I thnk John deserves more attention is a big red flag in my eyes.


John definitely deserves attention, but I think the attention being on you and Yoshistar right now is a good thing.  I don't like that John rode the easy lynch D1, went after Alaktorn right from the get go today, and then has disappeared now that things are going in a different direction than he wanted.  What do you make of that, who would be buddies with John in this situation if he were mafia?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #710 - 08/13/16 at 10:12:58  
TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 06:59:01:
With the knowledge we now have, I have such high confidence in the counterwagon that started on TYG and the people that were on it. In retrospect I feel very bad for killing off that wagon because I was too confident in my read on Leone. It also explains a lot why that wagon did not take off at all, it was indeed because mafia was pulling so hard on Leone.

Dan and Zoran shoot up in my townrankings for starting this wagon and Zwiebel gets a town ean as well. Leone is confirmed town as we know now. In my opinion, this wagon has a big chance of being pure.

Good, I stated exactly this in 582. I'm glad somebody else agreed with me on this point.

DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:06:04:
John - He really only pushed on the obvious lynch candidate yesterday, Leone, and now he comes out at the beginning of the day and thought the pressure should be on Alaktorn more than TYG.  If he's mafia at some point the mafia will have to put some suspicion on other members of the mafia and he would have looked even worse to me had he not said TYG looked scummy at all, so I don't give him town points for that.

Yes, the 2 people I felt most suspicious of yesterday were Leone and Michele, as already stated multiple times. However, since Leone spent most of his time after me, I don't understand why I wouldn't be expected to continually push on him. Even though we know *now* that he was town, he still acted like scum most of D1, and I wasn't going to let him divert that attention to me since I legitimately thought he *was* scum.

DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:06:04:
Alaktorn - Just by virtue of the SG night kill.

JUST by virtue of that? What the hell happened to:

DansGame wrote on 08/12/16 at 14:35:38:
Leone wrote on 08/12/16 at 13:56:03:
@#463 I've iterated I haven't looked at alak in detail yet; I'm not giving him a lean either direction until I look in detail at their interactions. Same goes for the others I've yet to analyze, but my vote is going to who I think, out of those I've looked at, has a high chance of being maf. If I find someone else acting weirder my vote will go there.

Seems like you're trying to divert attention from yourself with that post. My vote stands.

TvK, Dan, thoughts on #463?


Honestly I can't blame him for wanting his vote to be on you.  Your self-vote never made sense to me and he's just trying to pick up on the scummy things you've said so far.  He points out that Alaktorn would look terrible if you get lynched and flip town, and I agree.  Not that it would make Alaktorn mafia, but that it would make him look incredibly stupid.

Nobody wants to join me on the TYG wagon?


Dan, you said you understood why my vote was on Leone, *and* that Michele would look terrible if Leone flipped town, which he has. So yes, I immediately started D2 with a vote on Michele, and I don't see how Leone flipping town doesn't also factor in to your view of Michele seeming scummier than on D1.

DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:06:04:
Townier than yesterday:
Zoran - his vote was never on Leone, he was going after PAF who I think is town, then he was the only person to join me on the TYG wagon when no one else was going.

Already addressed in 582 - due to TYG wagon, you/Zoran are currently my biggest townreads, even if you don't feel the same about me for some reason.

ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:30:20:
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 06:54:00:
I think that's a good idea.  However, I also think that mafia might have put one person on the other side of the Alaktorn/Dan exchange.  If Alaktorn is town, John is mafia and the person on the other side of that exchange.

John being Mafia wouldn’t surprise me.

It would certainly surprise me!

DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:38:42:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 07:30:20:
Then you’re pretty sure John is Mafia.

Yeah, tbh I think he's more likely scum than you.  As I said earlier, I don't think you so bullishly put Leone and I as 100% mafia together if you are mafia knowing that Leone will flip town.  And, I think John has been trying to take the easy road by targeting Leone and then you, plus I really really don't like his "pretty sure we're going to have to choose between Alaktorn and Dan at some point" comment.

I still stand by that comment - I do believe that there is a maf out of you/Michele. Until I see something to tell me otherwise, I believe it's Michele currently. My first posts of the game were pointing out that I didn't like the way he was interacting with you, I didn't say anything about Leone until after talking about you two.

Yoshistar™ wrote on 08/13/16 at 08:03:29:
You have to give us GOOD reads to make it convincing Lewis, saying that your reads suck is not a good way to get away with it.

Is anyone gonna join me in a good hearty laugh?

TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 08:22:57:
Okay, I'm determined now to keep an eye on everyone today, and to stop focusing on one person. So let's have a look at John. I really don't like the way he came in left again.

johnboy81918 wrote on 08/13/16 at 06:34:00:
Well, that sucks. However, I think we all know where to begin this day...
[vote]ALAKTORN[/vote]

Let's see what Michele has to say about Leone flipping town, after claiming multiple times that it was impossible.

To address some other points that came up after I was gone for the end of D1:
Dan (507): Yes, I did say that I'd need to choose between you/Michele at some point. In 385, I say Michele is the more likely maf out of you two. Also see my post 465 where I still say Michele is my second biggest scumread (after Leone), based on his interaction with you. Particularly now that Leone has flipped town, Michele is my biggest scumread and I feel better about you as a result.
Racer (572/577): Literally 1 minute apart...first votes for Leone, then says maf would "hop on a mislynch" - you mean like you just did?
TYG: Already addressed by multiple other people, outright stating that you're withholding reads because they might hurt town? No, withholding information hurts town more - we need all we can get. Seriously, that's the point of this damn game. Finally posts reads 4 minutes before EoD, most of which are "not sure yet"
Zoran: Immediately jumped on TYG's "not gonna post reads because I'll hurt town" post, as it deserved. Helped jumpstart the counterwagon there (I think Dan already had his vote there before, but he was the only one for a while) even if TvK killed it. Also the only person besides me to get scumread on Michele from the exchanges with Dan, which I also mention in 385.

Based on the above, as of right now my 2 biggest townreads are Dan/Zoran, and my 2 biggest scumreads are Michele/Lewis. If Dan/Zoran are town, then the wagon on Lewis is gonna look extremely clean, unless maf!Timur decided to hop on there to avoid being on the Leone mislynch (definitely something to consider, though I don't have any strong feelings about him one way or the other yet).


What do you think of his strong vote on ALAKTORN? He says there has to be one scum between Dan and ALAK, and as Dan is his top town read, it has to be ALAK. However, his top town read Dan has already said he think ALAK is town as well. Which is also something I have said too. Does this feel like John is doing the exact same thing as last day? Yes, I think it does. Just like yesterday, he's putting his vote on someone with a lot of determination. Once again, others get very little attention. In this post it seems like he thinks Racer's last minute vote moght be scummy, but in one of his next posts he says it's probably too stupid to be maf. He's also talking about TYG, apparently saying that he thinks TYG is being scummy, but once again, he formulates it in such way that he can either say that TYG is scummy or that TYG is just stupid town. It's a very shady post, if you ask me.

Yes, maybe I'm susceptible to getting tunnel vision, but that's exactly what I've already mentioned in this post - if Leone flipped town, Michele would far and away be my biggest scumread. I've yet to see anything to convince me otherwise.

Regarding TYG: Where do I say he's either maf or stupid town? I literally said (in the post you quoted!) that he/Michele are my biggest scumreads. Not sure how you managed to miss that.

This post has gotten long, I will make another. Still catching up.
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Fant0m wrote on 12/17/11 at 15:59:31:
You could also do it just because you enjoyed hopping for no reason.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #711 - 08/13/16 at 10:13:14  
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:52:49:
ALAKTORN wrote on 08/13/16 at 09:25:28:
I suppose Dan and Zoran look better in my eyes after this analysis. I think the SG kill is something Dan would do though, didn’t he go for Lafungo in Shock’s first game? But Kyle was also part of that Mafia team.


One thing I will agree with, I don't think the SG kill happens in a team where all the mafia players are inexperienced.  I think there is at least 1 "experienced" player on the team making that kill.  Weird to me then that Kyle brought up the possibility of the mafia team being PAF, Racer, and TYG.  Also weird that TvK's four strongest town leans were 4 of the most experienced players.  If he was town he would be adding himself as a 5th very experienced player.  Does TvK town really come up with those reads and not bring up the SG kill?

I want to hear everyone give their analysis of TvK.  Is he mafia?


It wouldn't be the first time that a more experienced player had me fooled. My game has always revolved around finding a maf member that somehow screwed up and working my way up through interactions with other players. I must say that going for Sportsguy is a ballsy move on maf's part that I didn't really expect today. But then again, I wouldn't have thought about killing Lafungo in the first game (I went for the much more obvious choice Zarkov as a bodyguard) for example. Anyway, I can see someone like John being perfectly able to pull off such a move. It also could have just been a random kill to make sure to get someone who wasn't doc protected. Discussing night actions requires too much speculation, which is something I'm not good at. I'd rather play questioning, pressuring and digging.
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Re: Mafia: Day 1 - Town of Memes
Reply #712 - 08/13/16 at 10:13:23  
TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 06:48:36:
I've put Kyle between brackets because he could be put in either category 2 or 3.

1. The instigators: TvK, PAF, ALAKTORN, Dan
2. The second wave: John, TYG(, Kyle)
3. The latecomers: (Kyle,) TYG, Sportsguy, PAF, Racer

There are two ways that a wagon on a townsperson can take off: either mafia started the wagon, together with some townspeople, with another member soon joining. Or townspeople started the wagon and some opportunistic maf members made sure it got up to speed. In either case, the people in the 2nd group are the first ones to look at.

I feel like the way this wagon started is the first way TvK mentioned it. TvK starts, town members join, then TYG and Kyle join in, other Maf. Again, just a theory, as IO'm leaning more towards YS being a Maf instead of Kyle.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #713 - 08/13/16 at 10:17:17  
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:05:58:
Tere is the matter of you not posting but being on. That is very suspicious, don't you agree.


I have this thread opened in a tab 24/7. I will read this thread every once in a while even when I'm not posting. If I keep on posting, I won't have the time to refresh my mnd and think of new angles to look at the game. As you can see in the cgi page, my actvity is consistent, and when there are gaps of me not posting, I still try to address as many posts as I can when I return. If this is an argument, then a lot of people deserve tons of pressure at this point.
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Re: Mafia: Day 1 - Town of Memes
Reply #714 - 08/13/16 at 10:20:34  
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:13:23:
I feel like the way this wagon started is the first way TvK mentioned it. TvK starts, town members join, then TYG and Kyle join in, other Maf. Again, just a theory, as IO'm leaning more towards YS being a Maf instead of Kyle.


Please please please. You're entire maf read of me is based off of a gut feeling or something like that. I don't know how long you've spent searching for substantial evidence against me, but you weren't able to find any. Please please please, at least consider the fact that I could be town and look at this wagon from a fresh angle. What can you see then?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #715 - 08/13/16 at 10:22:12  
And just to be certain: I am going to get something to eat. I probably won't post in the next 30 minutes, but I'll still show up as being active in the MB. Please don't call me out on that.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #716 - 08/13/16 at 10:22:30  
Hey, remember sportsguy saying that he thought people that were asking lots of questions "too good of a townie"? Well, look at TvK, and now SG is dead...

TvK is currently a small maf lean for me, close to neutral.
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ALAKTORN wrote on 08/18/16 at 15:07:13:
I don’t make mistakes. Others do and I pick up on them.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #717 - 08/13/16 at 10:29:29  
TvK wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:17:17:
Racer727 wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:05:58:
Tere is the matter of you not posting but being on. That is very suspicious, don't you agree.


I have this thread opened in a tab 24/7. I will read this thread every once in a while even when I'm not posting. If I keep on posting, I won't have the time to refresh my mnd and think of new angles to look at the game. As you can see in the cgi page, my actvity is consistent, and when there are gaps of me not posting, I still try to address as many posts as I can when I return. If this is an argument, then a lot of people deserve tons of pressure at this point.


Hmm... have to agree with this, I sometimes spend A LOT of time rereading.
Also Racer, haven't you given enough pressure on TVK yet? As much as TVK had none on D1, I thought you agreed in putting pressure on the most inactive as well.
I suddenly thought about the chance of Racer being coached by maf. Is his experience on his 2 games beside this one enough for something like this? TVK is now man's target, if he's town and you ignore people's suspicion on him...idk, but worth the thought.
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ALAKTORN wrote on 08/18/16 at 15:07:13:
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #718 - 08/13/16 at 10:30:38  
"TVK is now man's target"
*maf
autocorrect Roll Eyes
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ALAKTORN wrote on 08/18/16 at 15:07:13:
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #719 - 08/13/16 at 10:40:25  
Just going to throw this out there: TvK, you know there's a very good reason for there to be pressure on you, regardless of alignment.  I won't say anything more about it now, but I'm curious to see how the day keeps evolving.
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #720 - 08/13/16 at 10:48:30  
johnboy81918 wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:12:58:
Yes, maybe I'm susceptible to getting tunnel vision, but that's exactly what I've already mentioned in this post - if Leone flipped town, Michele would far and away be my biggest scumread. I've yet to see anything to convince me otherwise.

Regarding TYG: Where do I say he's either maf or stupid town? I literally said (in the post you quoted!) that he/Michele are my biggest scumreads. Not sure how you managed to miss that.

This post has gotten long, I will make another. Still catching up.


Why do you think you're currently the only one voting ALAKTORN? Did you expect anyone voting ALAKTORN right from the start of the day?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #721 - 08/13/16 at 10:53:58  
Allright, I agree with the consensus that there's probably at least one really smart player in the Maf team, for me that would mean one or more of

Alaktorn
TvK
Dan
Zoran

are Mafia.

I don't think Zoran is Maf, he's using sound logic so far and isn't just going with the flow. Attacking people if he feels they are suspicious. Not afraid.

I don't think Alaktorn is Maf either, his D1 play was just too reckless and aggressive to be from a Maf player(esp since Leone flipped Town - if he flipped Maf, Alak couldve been bussing hard to get cred. This way is makes no sense to me for him to be Maf)

So it's either Dan or TvK or both as Maf. People have been all over TvK today, but I'm not sure about that. Both of them have been posting a lot, and I feel Dan has been more suspicious than TvK so far to me(look back D1). However, I think a TYG lynch would give us a lot of information on TvK. TYG's game was pretty bad so far, and all he's doing right now to defend? He's joining existing wagons/opinions.

I think the TYG wagon was good, and if TYG flips Maf then I'm pretty sure TvK is Maf too and tried to save his buddy by making the wagon seem less appealing to other Town players.

About YS, I think he's just a terrible player, can't tell if bad Maf or bad Town. I wouldn't be opposed to go for him too today, and like Alaktorn already said it could also have implications on kyle/TvK if he flips Maf. I think he needs to post more and his alignment will become super obvious at one point. If he keeps laying low though, I think he's a really good lynch today.

Also, I think this TvK wagon is getting too much popularity too fast. Just like Leone yesterday..makes me feel better about TvK. I'll have to read a lot of his posts back to make more of a statement on him. And I encourage everyone who wants to make an informed argument against him to do so as well. I will jump on anyone who follows a lynch wagon blindly today. This isn't D1 anymore, we have a lot of informaiton to work with now.
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TvK wrote on 05/27/14 at 03:07:54:
You should all listen to Timur. He's an onion.



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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #722 - 08/13/16 at 10:55:02  
johnboy81918 wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:12:58:
johnboy81918 wrote on 08/13/16 at 06:34:00:
Well, that sucks. However, I think we all know where to begin this day...
[vote]ALAKTORN[/vote]

Let's see what Michele has to say about Leone flipping town, after claiming multiple times that it was impossible.

To address some other points that came up after I was gone for the end of D1:
Dan (507): Yes, I did say that I'd need to choose between you/Michele at some point. In 385, I say Michele is the more likely maf out of you two. Also see my post 465 where I still say Michele is my second biggest scumread (after Leone), based on his interaction with you. Particularly now that Leone has flipped town, Michele is my biggest scumread and I feel better about you as a result.
Racer (572/577): Literally 1 minute apart...first votes for Leone, then says maf would "hop on a mislynch" - you mean like you just did?
TYG: Already addressed by multiple other people, outright stating that you're withholding reads because they might hurt town? No, withholding information hurts town more - we need all we can get. Seriously, that's the point of this damn game. Finally posts reads 4 minutes before EoD, most of which are "not sure yet"
Zoran: Immediately jumped on TYG's "not gonna post reads because I'll hurt town" post, as it deserved. Helped jumpstart the counterwagon there (I think Dan already had his vote there before, but he was the only one for a while) even if TvK killed it. Also the only person besides me to get scumread on Michele from the exchanges with Dan, which I also mention in 385.

Based on the above, as of right now my 2 biggest townreads are Dan/Zoran, and my 2 biggest scumreads are Michele/Lewis. If Dan/Zoran are town, then the wagon on Lewis is gonna look extremely clean, unless maf!Timur decided to hop on there to avoid being on the Leone mislynch (definitely something to consider, though I don't have any strong feelings about him one way or the other yet).


What do you think of his strong vote on ALAKTORN? He says there has to be one scum between Dan and ALAK, and as Dan is his top town read, it has to be ALAK. However, his top town read Dan has already said he think ALAK is town as well. Which is also something I have said too. Does this feel like John is doing the exact same thing as last day? Yes, I think it does. Just like yesterday, he's putting his vote on someone with a lot of determination. Once again, others get very little attention. In this post it seems like he thinks Racer's last minute vote moght be scummy, but in one of his next posts he says it's probably too stupid to be maf. He's also talking about TYG, apparently saying that he thinks TYG is being scummy, but once again, he formulates it in such way that he can either say that TYG is scummy or that TYG is just stupid town. It's a very shady post, if you ask me.

Yes, maybe I'm susceptible to getting tunnel vision, but that's exactly what I've already mentioned in this post - if Leone flipped town, Michele would far and away be my biggest scumread. I've yet to see anything to convince me otherwise.

Regarding TYG: Where do I say he's either maf or stupid town? I literally said (in the post you quoted!) that he/Michele are my biggest scumreads. Not sure how you managed to miss that.

This post has gotten long, I will make another. Still catching up. [/quote]

You're clearly frustrated about TYG withholding his reads and you're disappointed with his readslist at the end of the day. You even say that this is hurting town. So which people would be hurting town? I'd say only stupid townspeople or mafia members. Which category would TYG fit in otherwise?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #723 - 08/13/16 at 10:56:33  
Messed up the quote again in my previous post. The deepest quote is by John, the next one by my and the most recent one is by John again. And I forgot to edit in a part with which I wanted to start the post:

Another thing I'm worried about is that the attention has totally shifted away from TYG. Racer, PAF or Yoshistar, don't you guys have anything to add to your vote on TYG? Btw Racer, do you think it's viable that both me and TYG are mafia?
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Re: Mafia: Day 2 - Town of Memes
Reply #724 - 08/13/16 at 10:57:47  
DansGame wrote on 08/13/16 at 10:40:25:
Just going to throw this out there: TvK, you know there's a very good reason for there to be pressure on you, regardless of alignment.  I won't say anything more about it now, but I'm curious to see how the day keeps evolving.


I can totally understand the pressure on me, but that's not going to stop me from trying to lead the town in the right direction.
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