Matt I think you are the project delayer to be dead honest.  No way a townie would take a risk of living from Night 3 until Day 6 with such valuable info.  Plus you probably STILL wouldn't have revealed if you didn't have so many votes and pressure on you.  Scum.

Zwiebel wrote on 04/04/11 at 09:48:05:


He couldn't make the claim of scanning you because he has no idea what your role is and has no role to make up.  Sword died, revealing his role name.  Ivo claimed revealing his role name.  So he had to use those two roles in his claim lol.  Then he probably used his own role name or one of his maf buddies and applied it to Darius.  That is the only thing that makes sense.  He also had no intention or desire to make this claim.  A true townie would have revealed the info immediately not 2 day / night cycles later and under an extreme amount of pressure.  He seemed super reluctant to claim.  No townie would do that.  The claim isn't real.  Good point about how MattV said you were maf several times earlier in the game (I'm sure it's quotable too I just gotta go now).  But now he claims not to have scanned you.    All evidence points to him being scum.  Hell the way he dealed with padz was scum.  Someone should also look what he did with NStride way back.  I really have to leave and don't have time to check it out now but I'll look later before EOD.  MattV has just gotta be scum.  Sorry but it's really the only appropriate way of looking at things at the moment and the only scenario I can think of that makes PERFECT SENSE!

TvL, I don't think it will make any difference if you post now or later, since we have discussed now anyway and there are plenty things Web could jump on for a bandwagon, don't think your post will change the way he'll respond in any way. We're in front of a really important lynch and the more information we have, the better, so I would really like to hear your thoughts not later but now. You've had some really good thoughts until now so your points could improve the discussion, if you just state them 1 hours before EOD there might not be enough time left to discuss your points properly.

Fine. If it's the wish of multiple people that I speak up, I will. I just hate that it gives Web an easy way out.

Basically the choice is between Matt V and Darius at this point. In one sense there's not much difference between either lynch: if the lynchee turns up town, the other one is scum. So there's not much difference in terms of information that we'll gain. Except maybe that there is the possibility that Matt might turn up admin.
If it comes down to whom I distrust most, then it's easily Matt. I've expressed my suspicions about him before. Darius I've always felt pretty good about, until the business with night 4 came up. Now that that's fully cleared up, I see no big reasons to suspect him. I had reasons to suspect Matt, and his claim could easily have been made up, so I'm sticking with him.

I still don't see why Darius would have pushed the suprsilver lynch so badly if he is Mafia, was so easy to switch up there and just go with Goose, but he sticked to the plan. I really need to reread day 2, been so long since that day. It could all have been part of a big overall Mafia plan to just dump one or two players in favor of getting a free pass into the endgame, but as Mafia, i would never play this way and find it hard to believe.

MVT, you better protect me or rvz this night, don't care whether it only has a 50% chance of succes.

MAN, i just realize i should have claimed Town Mason Troll or something like that, if matt would have posted and claimed that name too, we would have got him, if he posted my correct role (with the canadian part) that would have 100% cleared him.

FUUUUCK i'm feeling so dumb right now. Esp because i've been in more games where you can find exact player roles.

Right, I have to go out, so here are my main points to prove Matt is lying:

1. Look at his reaction the morning after his result. First he makes a post apologising for not being around much. Then we get:

Matt V wrote on 03/28/11 at 08:45:12:


Doesn't look a post from someone who knows either me or Ivo is mafia. Then we get:

Matt V wrote on 03/28/11 at 09:16:12:


So he thinks I'm a maf lean and Ivo is a town lean, but he's still voting Zwiebel when he 'knows' one of us is mafia? His fourth post is the one that nails home he didn't have that information:

Matt V wrote on 03/28/11 at 16:29:16:


I just can't comprehend a town player having that attitude with the knowledge that either Ivo or I was mafia.

2. The fact that he claimed to get these results on N3 and then waited until D6 to tell us. This is both too long to wait to perform the action, given that he could have easily been lynched or NKed before N3, and too long to wait to claim the results, given that his claimed role is one-shot and so useless after he claimed.

3. The whole 'untargettable' situation. Either I can't be targeted by actions or I can. He targeted me with an action, so if I was untargettable or my role delayed actions, that would have happened; if Matt had the role he says he has then he would have known neither of these was true. He was sure I couldn't be targeted yesterday when Padz was pushing that idea, now he says 'I really dunno'? Why would he agree with that conclusion yesterday if he had already successfully targeted me and had a result of 'Project Delayer'? Nothing about that indicates that I would be untargettable, yet he was super-confident to join Padz in pushing the idea and didn't once indicate doubts with that idea, or the fact that Tim couldn't have blocked me if I was untargettable. Now he conveniently suggests because his action targets 3 people, his role would have bypassed it.

4. We've already had 'town female intuition' and a suspected JOAT flip, which likely would have had an investigative role. Matt's now claiming a third investigative role with effectively 3 cops in 1.  Seems way overpowered to me.

I should be able to come back and make at least one more post, but the evidence is there in case I don't.

Ivo: my rolename is Pobre, and my role could help to stop mafia killing me. I will fullclaim if it's necessary but I'd rather keep the mafia in the dark as to how.

Darius post made a lot of sense. I'm to gullible when it comes to believe claims I guess. Also a little unexperienced on that point. Matt V's claim is leaking legitism on several parts now.

Ivootjes wrote on 04/04/11 at 10:42:07:


Sorry but I'm a roleblocker not a protector.  I'll do my best.  If we go ahead with the MattV lynch, who should I block tonight?  Should I still go with Darius?  I'll try to block whoever you guys want me to.

If matt turns up town than off course you should try to block darius o_0 That would mean darius is a power role Mafia and you should try to block him from whatever he is able to do.

yeah, web seems fine by me.

I don't think he's town at least, although the way he tried to convince us not to vote for padz did look like me being a clueless townie. I've had that feeling so often like he had yesterday.

My friend's leaving thing has been cancelled so I should be able to stay on for an hour or two.

If MVT really is a blocker, Web my top pick for mafia so yeah, he's a good block. It's definitely not RVZ or Ivo and I have a pretty strong town read on TvL. I would put it at Web, Zwiebel, MVT in order of likeliness to be mafia. Still a bit doubtful of MVT's ability working when Ivo blocked everyone, but all roleblocks resolving at the same time is a common way of dealing with night action resolution. Am going to think on that one a bit more.

Ok, here we go

Vote: Matt V