Wow, I missed a lot of discussion over the past few weeks! It's good to see.

First off, in response to Simon's question about different levels of GOD times: personally, I would choose "G" (standards slightly harder than "A"). But I like "A" as well.

Personally, if I ever achieve a GOD standard then I wouldn't feel as if the standards are hard enough. That's why I really like the page at Masakazu and Monchuck's website, which shows the "fastest" driving lines for each course (using NBT) and giving a proposed fastest 5lap time and Flap time (which I've always considered to be their idea of the course's limits, but perhaps I'm just jumping to conclusions since I can't read Japanese ). The times they post at that page are insanely fast (with the exception of a couple tracks).

I've had so much fun playing smk on the Player's Site and the Non-NBT site over the last while and after seeing everyone's constant improvements it's brought me into the state of mind where I believe all WRs could be faster (similarly to what Simon was saying). I'm definitely not trying to take away the feeling of accomplishment or the time and effort it took for players to achieve their WRs, but I just feel "there is always room for improvement". And I think faster standards could motivate players to bring their PRs and WRs even lower than was ever thought possible.

So, I tend to lean towards the idea of GOD standards being virtually impossible to reach, since it is the highest standard after all.

I like the idea of the rest of the standards being changed as well (Legend, King, etc..) to balance out the new GOD standards. I agree with Simon that the standards wouldn't be balanced if only the GOD standards were changed. I feel that a Legend time should still take me a lot of work and effort to achieve. And Joe, don't worry about BC1  It took me nearly 18 months to get GOD on BC1 flap at the Player's Site. Stick with it!

And as for those GOD standards you posted, Simon: I like that they're fast  As for KB1: getting a 47"xx is definitely something I'm aiming for before my karting career ends, so at first I felt that the GOD time you posted wasn't as fast as it could have been. But, over the past few weeks I've realized just how fast I would have to drive to achieve a 47"xx and it just doesn't seem at all realistic for me anymore (especially considering my best 1st laps on that course aren't very strong at all). So I would agree with your 5lap GOD for KB1 (though, maybe even 47"74?). As for the flap, well I'm quite weak at flaps so I wouldn't really know. Keep in mind that my 9"39 wasn't the last lap in a 5-lap attempt, and I feel the 5th lap strategy can gain about "05-"10 (just a guess, and maybe I'm being a bit generous with "10), so I personally wouldn't mind seeing the flap a bit quicker  Nice job on those proposed GOD times.

Lastly, I hope we can please everybody (as hard as that is). I would definitely be interested in new standards at both the Players' Site and the Non-NBT site, but if it will only discourage newer players then I wouldn't mind keeping the old standards. Hope things work out for everyone.

rufen87   wrote on 05/08/05 at 10:40:51:


Thats exactly how I feel, I couldn't have said it better!  
This is why we still need the Standards and SR score, as well as keep the current score system! And it seems  that many players are going for A category or better now  . I can see the point of doing so, but I also predict some problems seeing some course's are really not maxed at all compared to others (as far as I can see on PAL)

The mail-link at the mainpage for Gerard Roodhorst (me) goes to kinnijup@... or someting, guess that's White's address, it should change to gerardroodhorst@hotmail.com

Perhaps we could make a section with Player's profiles or anything. Just like on the main page, but then with a bit more info.

Yes, the idea of players' profiles has been brought at a few occasions in the past, and I sure think it would be an important addition to the site as well. Ray Bergstrom was initially working on the excel file that was supposed to generate those profiles for each player automatically. The file was nearing completion on last news that I had (last January), but I haven't truly gotten in contact with Ray since then, so I wouldn't know exactly at the moment, but probably he's been quite busy in the last few months.

If anyone wants to go ahead with the players' profiles' project, like Pierre did for the top times tables, then he/she is more than welcome! I have potentially sufficient information in my own excel file to have the players' profiles display their Non-NBT rank and standard for every PR, along with their SR score, total times, average ranking, total score statistics and the like.   The only problem I have, and essentially what led me to abandon one year ago, is that I have no idea how to import data into an html page directly from cells (in Microsoft excel) in an adequate manner (Mark Jones had given me an excel file containing a macro that they were using for the MKDD site at the time, however the macro was hardly suitable with my file, and it appeared to contain a major bug when you entered new players in the file (I do not reject the possibility that I was the one inducing the bug, obviously  ) .

If someone thinks he/she could help me on this, then I would gladly be willing to try once again to get those automatic macros working correctly. Only keep in mind that I won't be volunteering to maintain the players' profiles myself if the work has to be done manually, such as it is done now for the top times tables. If all of the above fails (or possibly even if it does not), then I reckon that Ray's file remains our safest bet. (however there again, unless Ray personally manages to lead the file to final completion, we'd be facing the same issue of data exporting from excel to html, only to a lesser extent)

The term "Myth"could replace GOD I think.

But what I wanted to say that it would be cool to link the times on the WR site to the actual vid on Chris's site (if available). I don't know if we can implement this, let me know

I like your idea Simon. Sounds great  And despite creating an oxy-moron when someone's driven a Myth time, I do like your idea about perhaps using the term "Myth", Gerard

So, will these sub-categories of the new standard all be called the same name? Or did you have something else in mind instead of using A, B, C, etc..? Just curious. Either way I like it.

yea the problem here is that no one discusses the strats, the  videos only reveal the general points.  unlike mk64 and mkdd, people know what's going on.  this blends into not many people caring about the standards and a closed community.

but on some corners, a boost is best.  some long turns require a jump in the middle.  this stuff is alright to see in videos, but often the videos of the best times aren't available, or it's hard to learn from a video instead of having the strat written down.

I'd have to side with Drew to some extent here.
Maybe it's that the top karters are so used to do what they're doing, they forget less advanced karters (like myself) don't pick up on little details that separates the turn from being something worse than perfect.
This is just a guess.

I say this because many times, I've watched videos, and by the looks of it, I am mimicking the video well enough that I'd think I'd have a lot better results, but I just don't.
I just can't get a lap below 12" 4X on MC1 for example, but it looks like I'm doing things right, or at least well enough to achieve times faster than my current.

I've seen a lot of videos featuring the Long Boost in MC2, for instance, but I still can't pull it off. Same thing with the route around the lake in CI2.
Some of this, I credit to my own inadequacies in execution, but in many ways, I am the perfect example of someone who appears to drive well, but just don't get the faster times the strategies can potentially yeild. (That's why I felt I should post here.) Perhaps I miss a slight boost somewhere, approach a corner in a more ineffecient way, jump at the wrong time, etc. The little things that you can't make out from watching the videos.

Andreas

Yeah excactly! The ghost can help!!

I made my experiences too with the ghost, especially at BC 1! Without a ghost i would never have gotten this 1,28,81 WR! Personally I feel you drive more riskfully when you are a little bit behind the ghost, and the point where you can learn the tight driving!  cuz when you see, that you win time over the ghost, you'll do the same strat or the same tightness in the next runs and you will become better and better!

nice greets from Germany!

Armin

Yeah I really like those proposed standards there, good work Simon. They fit in with the rest well  

I cant judge KB2 though!  

About MC1, personally I think Sami should at least have double GOD there. So 12"08 is the one to go for.

I know he didn't use the first pipecut, but he maxed this course so much that that little 0"04 extra is probably the only part where winning time is possible (due to the pipecut he didn't use)