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Three Stars (Read 16543 times)
Etch
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #400 - 09/10/16 at 16:39:08
 
Alicia Kart wrote on 09/05/16 at 18:26:25:
I can't believe someone 3-star'd Extra Lightning 150cc without any coin ! Shocked


Trust me, the snapshot is sexier than the run...



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Re: Three Stars
Reply #401 - 12/22/16 at 17:18:08
 
Yep, you can clear the game not touching the r button once...
http://www.mariokart64.com/mkds/archives/nortrips.jpg



For the most part, the used games I bought online had ghosts which never hopped.  That's what got me thinking triple stars might be possible if one manipulates skill points correctly.  And apparently, grabbing enough coins and finishing just fast enough can still get the job done!
That was fun... Smiley
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #402 - 02/11/17 at 05:38:50
 
According to a guidebook released in Japan 2001, the score for rank is increased when the CPs use a lightning volt. I believe that this has something to do with the "UnknownValue" in Ferneu's rank calculation guide....
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #403 - 02/11/17 at 15:16:19
 
Hey, I think you're right!!! Shocked

I did a test with 2 player GP mode...

My sister spammed a ton of lightning bolts in the first track.  After that, I avoided coins and generating mt's as much as possible.  I even used a restart because I wasn't going to finish first on one of the other tracks.  Going off what I learned from zero coin mode, I truly believe bolts were the only reason this horrendous run could have possibly returned three stars.  Unbelievable...

Etch - 1P
https://i.imgur.com/g9dWbYG.png

Imouto - 2P
https://i.imgur.com/lNQofgI.png

It's also very rare to get bolted by cpu's so that might explain why Ferneu never saw that value change?

Thanks for this insight Airship804, I think the guide is complete now!



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Re: Three Stars
Reply #404 - 02/12/17 at 05:55:37
 
Nice experiment! I'm glad that my information turned out to be true!

You used a retry and still got 3-star rank!? I guess this rule is set in order to make up for the delay (and lower score for racing time) caused by lightning strikes, but now I've just seen what happens when too much lightnings come at once!

Also, actually I've never played 2-player GP, so I didn't know that the other human player's lightning bolts are counted as well as the CPs' ones. Now, I've just come up with an idea from your experiment.... With the help of the second player, will it be much, much easier to obtain 3-star ranks even for those who're not super-skilled...?! That's rather cheaty...
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #405 - 02/12/17 at 09:56:12
 
That's amazing, thanks for the info, Airship! (And Etch for the experiment!)

So the ranking formula is fully figured out now (or at least the influencing factors)...  Shocked
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I came here because of the game, but I stayed because of the people... Smiley
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #406 - 02/12/17 at 23:26:24
 
Airship804 wrote on 02/12/17 at 05:55:37:
Also, actually I've never played 2-player GP, so I didn't know that the other human player's lightning bolts are counted as well as the CPs' ones. Now, I've just come up with an idea from your experiment.... With the help of the second player, will it be much, much easier to obtain 3-star ranks even for those who're not super-skilled...?! That's rather cheaty...




Yup Airship804 and I agree with you it's cheaty; 2 player GP mode related picture^

Playing only in 1 player GP mode to get all the 3-star ranks should be the nindō of the MKSC clan Smiley
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« Last Edit: 07/06/17 at 13:10:27 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #407 - 02/13/17 at 14:53:12
 
Airship804 wrote on 02/12/17 at 05:55:37:
You used a retry and still got 3-star rank!?


It's a big penalty but it can be easily offset collecting points elsewhere.

Check the first reply on this page, I did just that all by myself and with no coins!

Airship804 wrote on 02/12/17 at 05:55:37:
I guess this rule is set in order to make up for the delay (and lower score for racing time) caused by lightning strikes


I agree, it's a very rare event and how dare the cpu punish you for being so fast!

// how many times were you hit by a lightning bolt?
// this is a good thing!

SkillPoints += lightning hits * 40;

Airship804 wrote on 02/12/17 at 05:55:37:
I didn't know that the other human player's lightning bolts are counted as well as the CPs' ones.


I guess it only cares if you are hit by lightning, regardless of user.

Airship804 wrote on 02/12/17 at 05:55:37:
With the help of the second player, will it be much, much easier to obtain 3-star ranks even for those who're not super-skilled...?! That's rather cheaty...


When you are on the 2-player GP cup menu, it inherits the rankings you set in 1-player GP mode.  I never played them all and yet I have triple stars listed everywhere.  Without buying a new cartridge or erasing my data, I highly doubt anything could be unlocked outside single player mode.  Also, it's painfully obvious when bolt abuse is used based on finishing times and coin total.

The reason I chose the extra lightning cup is that lots of points are lost spending frames over the water in KB1 and mud in CI2.  No matter how clean my driving, getting above one star with around 40'ish coins is tough and only so many item boxes to run through.  It's also quite a gap to bridge and reach three stars in this fashion.  That's why I believe the lightning bolt was the missing piece of this puzzle!

Bottom line, if you want all three stars grab coins/hold a/hit item boxes/do mt's/finish fast.

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« Last Edit: 02/14/17 at 14:07:14 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #408 - 02/18/17 at 16:04:17
 
One more time...



I really hope Ferneu comes across this recent revelation.  It would mean a lot to him to see his unknown value finally validated!  This is why I went for broke to be certain lightning bolts helped your skill points, lol.
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« Last Edit: 06/22/17 at 17:21:00 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #409 - 02/21/17 at 18:15:50
 
I finished my zero coins 150cc playlist...
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCOe9qu_RnuKeuI1y31kjs1EvRyJh52hr

I refuse to live extra star/special, too hard...! lol

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #410 - 06/29/17 at 19:19:04
 
Etch wrote on 02/13/17 at 14:53:12:
I highly doubt anything could be unlocked outside single player mode.


I recently got a new cartridge so I decided to investigate this matter.  Even though my shitty used game was the host, I was able to select any track since the 2p had everything unlocked!  From what I can tell, any finishes in multi don't affect your home settings.  I'll goof around more to convince myself but that's probably the case.  Same goes for rating.

Yup, no dice...lol



For now, I'll aim for a higher coin total...
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« Last Edit: 06/30/17 at 17:24:13 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #411 - 07/02/17 at 15:24:30
 
Boy was I out of shape, but I completely overhauled my 150cc driving and reached totals I once thought were impossible...

https://i.imgur.com/WOCYMfA.jpg

3121/3300 nitro clear



Retro tracks, you're next...
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #412 - 07/03/17 at 18:16:34
 
Etch wrote on 07/02/17 at 15:24:30:


lol I see that the "Four Stars" is still there^ Smiley



In my opinion Etch Super Saiyan 4 is fake-- time to Make Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan 3 Stars Great Again Smiley
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« Last Edit: 07/06/17 at 13:11:55 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #413 - 07/04/17 at 06:52:25
 
Chrono Krysster II wrote on 07/03/17 at 18:16:34:
time to Make Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan 3 Stars Great Again Smiley


I didn't waste my holiday weekend for nothing!

2880/3300 retro clear

https://i.imgur.com/T6NXwF5.jpg

Which means 6001/6600 total clear...



This was a dream of mine almost 2 years ago and to think I could pull it off, I'm speechless...

I cried just like when I hit zero coins extra special 150cc...no words...

USA!
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« Last Edit: 07/04/17 at 07:24:01 by Etch »  

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #414 - 07/06/17 at 19:29:59
 
Etch wrote on 07/02/17 at 15:24:30:
https://i.imgur.com/WOCYMfA.jpg

3121/3300 nitro clear


Congratulations Etch Cool..

Etch wrote on 07/04/17 at 06:52:25:
2880/3300 retro clear

https://i.imgur.com/T6NXwF5.jpg


..I mean Congratulations Etch Cool

Etch wrote on 07/04/17 at 06:52:25:
Which means 6001/6600 total clear...


..I meant that I kept the full HD version of this only for you Etch: http://img110.xooimage.com/files/4/7/c/ddqf5qyvwaakzay.jpg-large-529ebbd.jpg Grin Wink
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #415 - 07/08/17 at 07:39:57
 
Haha, thanks but I think my mission is complete now... Wink

Retro Clear / No MT's!
https://i.imgur.com/Hroafwe.jpg

I did the first three 50cc cups No-R at least.  Even with hopping, this was pretty tricky and you really have to pile up your skill points and avoid touching any walls.  I was pretty discouraged last night but finished off the final cups this morning after sobering up.  Unless I can think of another retarded challenge I believe I pushed beyond my own limits and then some...

Feel pain, contemplate pain, accept pain, know pain.  One who does not know pain cannot possibly understand three stars.  I will never forget Brutus' pain.  And now, this world shall know pain...almighty push!



The Six Paths of Pain in attendance...


See you later! Smiley
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #416 - 07/08/17 at 08:08:49
 
Meanwhile Lafungos still has blue noob background smh  Lips Sealed
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #417 - 07/09/17 at 19:11:28
 
Part I

Etch wrote on 07/08/17 at 07:39:57:
Haha, thanks but I think my mission is complete now... Wink


Not really!
I'm not requesting you to do the 6600/6600 (sigh!), but at least --and as long as you like doing these retarded challenges-- maybe you could perfect a bit your retro total for reaching 200 coins everywhere-- as you did in nitro Smiley

Etch wrote on 07/08/17 at 07:39:57:
Feel pain, contemplate pain, accept pain, know pain.  One who does not know pain cannot possibly understand three stars.  I will never forget Brutus' pain.  And now, this world shall know pain...almighty push!


I completely agree with you, and I understand, but if you really contemplate me, accept me, know me, you will realize that...



Tobi continued... there in part 2, Kamui!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #418 - 07/10/17 at 15:50:21
 
Chrono Krysster II wrote on 07/09/17 at 19:11:28:
as long as you like doing these retarded challenges-- maybe you could perfect a bit your retro total for reaching 200 coins everywhere-- as you did in nitro Smiley


I was lucky to scrape by in 50cc, as of right now there's just 5 cups I'm not so sure about because of coin placement and obstacles.

Tapping the gas as much as I did, going OoB to slow down which doesn't cost skill points helps but that's not an option on some courses.  Considering my previous totals it was a vast improvement and I'm not in a hurry to climb higher for now.

If you don't feel pain, you must be numb to the daily grind entirely...lol.
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #419 - 10/15/17 at 11:54:27
 
Sorry for taking so much time to answer. I saw what Airship804 posted, but I just could not find enough time to test it. I was in the middle of a project that was taking pretty much all my spare time. Now things are starting to calm down a little bit, so I decided to check it out. Not that I needed though. It seems that Etch has already done all the checking we needed using the real hardware Smiley

Anyway, my mother always told me to never trust a guy with 6 GBAs. Specially one that is able to get the legendary 4 star ranking. So, I decided to check it myself.

Airship804 was totally right! The "unknown value" does indeed change when you get hit by lightning! Thank you so much Airship804!!!

And you guys were totally right, the reason I never saw it change before was because the AI seldom uses the lightning bolt. Specially against a player that is in the last place, has been lapped a couple of times and is hitting his head against a wall while throwing green shells at himself.

In the matter of fact, the AI barely uses lightning bolts period. When I am in the 1st place I am gifted with tons of red shells and a few ghosts. Sometimes when I am near someone the fella may use a star. But lightning bolts??? No sir.

It took me some hours to get "lucky" enough to be struck one single time! And that has taken almost all my free time.

What we know for sure now is that if you got hit by lightning, that unknown value will be set to 1. What remains to be tested is that if it is incremented on each new hit. I am assuming it is, but I just do not have enough free time to test it right now.

In any case, I have submitted an updated version of the FAQ to GameFaqs where I replaced "unknown value" by LightningHits.

I am also going to take the chance and update the quick colored guide I posted here.

PS: I've been lurking here from time to time seeing the crazy stuff Etch has being doing and I would just like to say that I think it is awesome. Too bad the GBA does not help very much, because I would love to see high quality videos of all that.





// The SkillPoints
//
// NOTICE: I will be using a C language notation for the SkillPoint calculation
// formula below. Math people usualy cringe when they see it, because stuff like
// x = x + 1 not only valid, but it is very very common. Anyway, it is very
// simple to understand: what is on the left side of the = sign receives the
// result of the operation on the right side. That is it. Simple as that. So
// x = 1 + 2
// means that the value of x is now 3, because the result of the operation on
// the right side, 1 + 2, is 3. Also
// x = x + 1
// means that the value of x is now whatever value x had plus 1. This kind of
// operation is used a lot. It is used so much that the C language guys created
// a little "short cut" for it, which consists in placing the operator just
// before the = sign, like this
// x += 2
// which means that x now have whatever value it had, plus 2, and is the same as
// x = x + 2
// If  change the operator, the operation changes (obviously), so
// x -= 2
// means that x now have whatever value it had, minus 2. All the conventional math
// rules apply so
// x += -3
// is the same as
// x = x + (-3)
// which is the same as
// x = x - 3
//
// Well, that is it for your quick C language tutorial. It is pretty easy to
// understand, and it is the notation I will be using below. But have no fear of
// raising your hand and asking me a question, if you do not understand it yet.
// I will try to explain it again as best as I can. So... time to carry on.
//
// The stats above are tracked during a race and then, right when you cross the
// finish line, the game calculates what I am going to call SkillPoints. The
// higher you SkillPoints the better. Some stats increment those points, and
// some decrement them. I think it is pretty clear which is which, but what is
// not clear is by how much they increase or decrese those SkillPoints. I mean,
// what WAS not clear, because here we go:


// the skill points for the track aways start at zero.
SkillPoints = 0;

// add the position points
SkillPoints += PositionPoints;

// yes coins ARE important Smiley
SkillPoints += Coins * 4;

// number of times you where struck by lightning bolts.
// Thanks to Airship804 for the hint! And Etch for testing it! You guys rock!

SkillPoints += LightningHits * 40;

// if the sum of all your lap times is greater than 59999 (9 minutes, 59 seconds
// and 99 cents), it is set to 59999. Also, if the result of the whole calculation below is less
// than 0 it is set to 0. That means that you lap times MIGHT increase your
// skill points, but they WILL NEVER decrease them.

SkillPoints += ((ccWeight * TrackValue) - (LapTime1 + LapTime2 + LapTime3 + LapTime4 + LapTime5)) / 8;

// you picked Bowser? Good for you!
SkillPoints += CharacterEndRaceValue;

// if you need to stop hitting the gas, be quick about it
SkillPoints -= FramesNotHittngGas / 4;

// unless you hit a banana, take you feet of the brake pedal. It will hurt your
// hard earned skill points bad. I am one of the worst MKSC players out there
// and even I have no need for brakes

SkillPoints -= FramesHittingBrake * 2;

// fortunately you will only get these items when you are not in 1st.
SkillPoints -= Item3RedSheelsUseCount * 5;
SkillPoints -= ItemStarUseCount       * 30
SkillPoints -= ItemLightningUseCount  * 5;

// Lakitu is NOT your friend
SkillPoints -= LakituRescueCount * 30;

// thy shall hit no one! Nor anything!
SkillPoints -= EntityHitCount * 15;

// Bowser Castle levels can be harmful
SkillPoints -= WallHitCount * 20;

// So KartSeven, what did ou say? That princess hitting me with 3 dozen red shells
// per lap would not take my 3 star rank away? Was that it? hehe

SillPoints -= GotHitAndSpunCount * 15;

// retrying does not automaticly take away your 3 star rank. Well... in theory.
// (3 - RemainingLifes) is how the game calculates your retry count. If you
// never retried, it will be 0 (you start with 3 lifes, remember?)

SkillPoints -= (3 - RemainingLifes) * 120;

// thy shall master the start miniturbo. When Lakitu rescues you, doing a
// miniturbo when he puts you back on the track ALMOST takes alway the
// SkillPoints you just lost

SkillPoints += StartMiniturboCount * 25;

// no surprise here
SkilPoints += DriftMiniturboCount * 15;

// well well well... Look what we got here!
SkillPoints += ItemBoxHitCountWhileFull * 15;

// I just wish the game would differentiate between being outside the track and
// being on water spots in the middle of the track on the beach races.

SkillPoints -= FramesOutsideTrack / 4;


// Rank
//
// your final rank is pretty simple. The SkillPoints are calculated for each of
// the 4 tracks, then we take the arithmetic mean and compare it to a couple of
// fixed values

Rank = (SkillPoints1 + SkillPoints2 + SkillPoints3 + SkillPoints4) / 4;


// now, if you got the first place on all 4 tracks...

if Rank > 329 then ***
if Rank > 199 then  **
if Rank >  99 then   *
if Rank >  29 then   A


// if not, then he game checks if you made at least 27 points

if Rank > 329 then **


// not even 27? Please tell me you made at least 21...

if Rank > 329 then *
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #420 - 10/16/17 at 15:06:39
 
Ferneu wrote on 10/15/17 at 11:54:27:
What remains to be tested is that if it is incremented on each new hit. I am assuming it is, but I just do not have enough free time to test it right now.


Based on some of my runs, I don't think I could have cleared three stars without that...

Which makes me wonder, are the skill points capped at some point...highest score possible?
Thanks for checking in and the update, I'll always stick to live recordings so if there's something you want I'll try if it's reasonable! Smiley
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #421 - 10/17/17 at 06:18:29
 
Ferneu wrote on 10/15/17 at 11:54:27:
What we know for sure now is that if you got hit by lightning, that unknown value will be set to 1. What remains to be tested is that if it is incremented on each new hit. I am assuming it is, but I just do not have enough free time to test it right now.


I think it's incremented for every hit. I'm not a super expert like Etch, and my best plays usually end up being "2-star" rated on 150cc Extra Special Cup. However, when I was playing the same cup just for fun using Mario, I was lightning'd for 4 times, and I got 3-star ranking for the first time ever! That was the luckiest thing that happened to me in the game. Usually they shoot lightning only once, or not at all. I don't think I will experience the same once again...!
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Re: Three Stars
Reply #422 - 11/17/17 at 17:47:13
 
Yep also total must be high bc I went overkill in 2P, lol!

Thanks for the shout out to us in the update Ferneu!

The PP will always keep researching! Smiley

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Re: Four Star
Reply #423 - 03/22/22 at 17:05:50
 
It's finally finished after 5 years and change!



Just 6417/6600 left!

This extra renewed my hatred for extra 150cc, yare yare daze...

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Re: Three Stars
Reply #424 - 03/24/22 at 21:10:19
 
Congratulations, this is an INCREDIBLE show of patience and dedication through the years to achieve the single best possible result in every facets of a game mode, and it commands mad respect !

Really hope you can complete the set with the Retro Tracks also, that would be glorious !

Hope this gets some kind of mention next time News come out, even if it's not in the standard Time Trials.
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