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Mario Kart >> Mario Kart Super Circuit >> Non-SC Standards Revision - Finished!
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Message started by Shock on 05/31/17 at 12:56:02

Title: Non-SC Standards Revision - Finished!
Post by Shock on 05/31/17 at 12:56:02

We have been working behind the scenes for some time now on doing a standards revision. The active players in the Discord channel, to my knowledge, unanimously agree that the standards need to be redone. This is mainly due to the extreme unbalance in difficulty across courses, because many standards are long-outdated due to discovery of new strats, and because many of the sub-God standards do not take into account alternate strats and the like but simply scale down from the God standard. There are also a couple/few typos that have never been fixed.

You can view the new proposed standards here. (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/15dV3Z8qec1F3A18lHJtusObgikpHBa6qFms4F8zcO8k/edit#gid=0)

The current set is the result after a couple drafts and a few voice calls comparing videos, "field testing" and the like with feedback primarily being from me, Lafungo, Stacy, and Chris. If you think a track/flap should have a different time as God, keep in mind that we are trying to simultaneously balance difficulty with the Gods suggested for the other tracks as well.

If you still feel a time is off, feel free to make your case, but please also defend it; point out where you think it fails matching difficulty, and a video or two to make your point would be great.

We will begin working at this point on the under-God standards. I'm thinking we're close enough to the "right" God times to be able to start work here before a general consensus on the God standards is reached. The new under-God standards will try to take into account the difficulty of strats on courses as well as take into consideration how spread out we expect times to be relative to their objective strength.

I'm hopeful that within a month we'll be able to fully revise and replace the current standards.

Edit on March 9th, 2018: Okay, that may have taken a bit longer than a month. But hopefully it was worth the wait!

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 06/01/17 at 15:41:20

Yay!
Bring on the new standards! :) I'll try spent some time looking over them and provide feedback when I get a mo.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by .Hahaae on 06/03/17 at 17:47:54

Wait, what does it mean by keep the old ones? That sounds kinda interesting in a way

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Etch on 06/04/17 at 13:56:40

It could function as a toggle, or like mk64 have one of them listed separately simply for historical reasons.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 07/14/17 at 05:05:39

Is there a planned timeline for introducing these new standards to the site?

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Sock on 07/22/17 at 10:59:23

Bump so more people can look these over and also vote in poll.

I'd like to go over the God standards at least 1 more time, but the big task we have right now is figuring out appropriate lower standards based on strats. Also, although I voted for replacing current standards, I'm also okay with adding a column to each profile so one can look at ARR for both new and old standards. I've thought about it a bit; at first, I didn't like the idea, because it struck me as odd and kinda sends a vibe that the standards are a matter of taste. But I think there's more of an argument to be made that some people might not want to use the new set, even if the old set is really broken, because for better or worse that's the set that the site has been using for around a decade now.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 07/22/17 at 12:43:31

I'm thinking a button to toggle between the two standards rather than show them both at the same time would be better. Also I'm up for the last round of discussing standards if there is one - currently playing as many as tracks as poss with zzmt so that I'll be more informed :P

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 09/04/17 at 05:36:38

Is the only thing in the way of introducing these new standards just the figuring out of the lower standards now? I want to get these on the site as soon as poss so I'll work on the lower stuff if that's all that's needed.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Shock on 09/04/17 at 12:21:19

Pretty much. Just a few slight revisions to the Gods but it's mostly just the lower stuff that's causing the holdup at this point. Any help would be appreciated as it seems I've kinda lost sight of what makes sense difficulty wise at the lower tiers...

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 09/04/17 at 13:30:19

Cool cool :)
Yeah me too tbh, but I'll give it a go and at least get something down, then can look it over afterwards.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 09/08/17 at 10:29:01

Alright so I did the E Standards (Myth E down to Beg E) for CL to SW today on the spreadsheet.
I'm doing them quite quickly, but I think they're pretty reasonable. I'll work on more tomorrow.

Furthermore, I've added a small summary of suggestions of alterations for god times beneath the god table on the first tab/sheet. Just so they don't get lost in the discord chat.

Edit: did up to rir flap

Edit2: did up to rbc1 flap

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision
Post by Mr.Nosey on 09/12/17 at 11:42:08

Done with the first revision of all sub-GOD standards!
I just did the ___ E standards, on the proviso that Andy can work his excel magic to fill in the in between using fifths.

I stuck only to .x0 and .x5 times, to avoid shit like this:
RKB1 old titan standards - 3"1, 3"12, 3"15, 3"16, 3"17

My new standards are based loosely on proportions of people, with only a few alterations here and there at the top, where I can more easily judge what times are reasonable for myth, titan and hero.
There's a lot of .00, .50 and .25s, so if that's something you have an objection to, please have a look over the sheet yourself and say what you think needs changing.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by Shock on 02/14/18 at 13:17:18

I think I'm going to go look over your work now, Nosey, and make some final tweaks. I finally finished the interpolation thanks to some quick research for a formula, Lafungo implementing it on the Excel file, then being able to drag that around a bit on the Excel file. Still took about an hour to finish, so feels good to be done with that part, lol.

Once we agree once and for all with the current God proposals and the rest of the ___ E standards are checked for reasonableness/strat difficulty consistency, we only have a final step of moving the columns for each course over to rows and saving the file as a .csv and sending it off to Alex!

Everyone, this is your last chance to look over the new standards before they go live!

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by DantheMunchlax782 on 02/14/18 at 13:43:45

yeah I don't know if I'm just natural at rCI1 5lap but the rCI1 5lap standards around the Intermediate and Beginner section seem awfully easy (My CI1 5lap is an Advanced B while my other times are like early intermediate late beginner. My first ever time for the stage was a Advanced C or D I believe so either I'm really good at it or these standards are EZPZ) so yeah make the rCI1 standards near the bottom a little harder

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by Shock on 02/26/18 at 14:14:10

We are finished with the first 25 tracks. Make sure to look them over and let us know if you think there's any standard that doesn't make sense or doesn't compare well with difficulty to the rest. (We still have rCI1 and afterwards to work on.)

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by Shock on 03/05/18 at 10:00:36

4C69663F303A080 wrote:

Thanks for the feedback. We will be bumping up Intermediate E and Advanced E by 3 seconds it looks like.

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by Shock on 03/09/18 at 08:45:37

I have e-mailed the file with the new standards to Alex. They should be live on the page very soon now!

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Final Phase!
Post by WAZZUPYOSHI on 03/09/18 at 18:53:45

The new standards are live!

Title: Re: Non-SC Standards Revision - Finished!
Post by Mr.Nosey on 03/10/18 at 14:08:25

Fantastic news! A huge thanks to everyone involved, this has been a long time coming and many people have put in a lot of time towards making these new standards reasonable and fair across the board. It's really satisfying seeing them finally up on the site :) [smiley=beer.gif]